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Specific adaptations to imposed demands. This might be simplified but im just gonna get the discussion rolling. If the specific adaptation we, or our athlete desires is imrproved athleticism that obviously the SAID principle would be paramount in designing a program. As PA space monkeys we know that Athleticism is an athletes ability to seemlessly and effortlessly move through space with primal movement patterns to complete a given motor task…(from memory, sorry…) As PA space monkeys we also know that there is a certain hierarchy to performance that an athlete must move through if they are to develop athleticism to their highest ability.
Mobility
Stability
Strength
Power
Speed
Replication of Speed
Competitive application<span style=”color: #ffffff; font-family: Georgia, ‘Times New Roman’, serif; font-size: 15px; line-height: 22.5px;”>ic to </span>
<p dir=”ltr” style=”border: 0px; margin: 0px; padding: 0px 0px 15px; background-color: #a7a9ac;”><span style=”color: #ffffff; font-family: Georgia, ‘Times New Roman’, serif;”><span style=”font-size: 15px; line-height: 22.5px;”>Through application of the SAID principle and analysis of an athlete’s limiting factors, we ultimately prioritize which energy systems, planes of motion and primal movement patterns to train in our program. We determine a volume and intensity distribution to drive optimal, and accelerated adaptation specific to the athlete’s sport.-Welbourne-</span></span></p>
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Sorry about that first post… @luke delete?
Specific adaptations to imposed demands. I’m gonna get the discussion rolling. If the specific adaptation we, or our athlete desire is improved athleticism than obviously the SAID principle would be paramount in designing a program. As PA space monkeys we know that Athleticism is an athletes ability to seamlessly and effortlessly move through space with primal movement patterns to complete a given motor task…(from memory, sorry…) As PA space monkeys we also know that there is a certain hierarchy to performance that an athlete must move through if they are to develop athleticism to their highest ability.
Mobility
Stability
Strength
Power
Speed
Replication of Speed
Competitive application“Through application of the SAID principle and analysis of an athlete’s limiting factors, we ultimately prioritize which energy systems, planes of motion and primal movement patterns to train in our program. We determine a volume and intensity distribution to drive optimal, and accelerated adaptation specific to the athlete’s sport.”-John Welbourne
SO, that being said, if there is an established pathway to athleticism, to competitive performance, through training, if an athlete can display characteristics of athleticism, and those characteristics can be adapted and altered than it can be said that specific demands can achieve that specific adaptation. If an athlete’s ability to be athletic relies on his ability to seamlessly and effortless complete a given motor task using primal movement patterns, and we know that proficiency in primal movement patterns has to do with intra and intermuscular coordination, and we know from our discussions around the novice effect that those two things are skills to be developed, than we can use our knowledge to impose specific demands on our athletes to achieve and accelerate the adaptation of those skills and eventually athleticism.
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It’s hard to add anything after JW’s quote. That is the connection in a nutshell. You made a nice point of being able to alter and adapt athleticism towards the demands of the sport. that is an important point.
I have been kind of holding on to the question assuming I would run across it in the reading but have not yet. What is the definition of replication of speed?
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Can you produce speed consistently on every attempt at a task? If you develop speed in one domain can you replicate that speed in all domains?
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@benkuch You can tie in to Hatfield’s strength definitions to build out a definition of repetition of speed.
Power: A Scientific Approach pg. 10:
- Strength Endurance: Your ability to put forth maximum muscular contractures time after time with no appreciable decline in force output.
- Speed Endurance: Your ability to maintain your maximum speed over distances less than 400 meters.
Then on pg. 11 Hatfield writes that “Strength and speed endurance come primarily from changing enzyme concentrations and pain tolerance.”
Speed is another means of force exertion, so I think Hatfield’s ideas apply here.
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We can also look at utilizing the novice window as our foundation to build athleticism. John mentioned multiple time’s it is possible to train athleticism. But to teach it we must use the chunking method. Basically, breaking down the language of movement into understandable and fundamental parts then continuously building on them over time. In other words, our planes and axis become primal movement, our primal movements become combined, we stress primal movements and the combined primals, and we continue to grow and practice our “dictionary” of movement over time to create a level of athleticism on the continuum.
Circling back to the novice effect, our ability to develop the BLoS in an athlete will make them more trainable. In turn, enhancing our ability, as a coach, to impose the specific demands to accelerate toward athleticism.
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@benkuch Love the BLoS acronym…who would’ve thought the military guy would create that? I know see myself as a coach and athlete frantically searching for more of it like this guy. (Just replace NOS with BLoS.)
I’m also going to start using “And Harry, I need it by tonight.” every time I ask for anything.
“Chad, pass me a coaster for this coffee mug. And Chad, I need it by tonight.”
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<p class=”p1″><span class=”s1″>@conorlynch que? sorry no spika inglish… maybe the other Harry will have it… Ha! I see Athleticism as the altruistic form of movement within a task(sport), in other words there is no one on this earth that is moving perfect or no one that is the “strongest there is” to quote the incredible Hulk. I agree with @benkuch that the idea of athleticism should start with the novice effect to build a base level of strength, but we are only the sum of our limiting factors and how we recognize them (internally and externally). </span></p>
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<p class=”p1″><span class=”s1″>To quote JW “The ability to seamlessly and effortlessly combine primal movement patterns through space to perform known and novel tasks”. When I read this reminds me(sorry I have to go there…) of the definition of virtuosity coined by Glassman: “performing the common uncommonly well.” But what is common and where is that common movement? That is where the SAID principle can be applied here because to perform the common uncommonly well denotes training and an OPPORTUNITY to evolve to asses limiting factors and attack them within a specific adaptation to an imposed demand (in this case field of sport).</span></p><p class=”p2″></p>
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“The ability to seamlessly and effortlessly combine primal movement patterns through space to perform know and novel tasks” -Athleticism according to J.Welbourn. Let’s look at the novel tasks, those that are unknown, but are still performed seamlessly and effortlessly by combining primal movement patterns. These non trained exercises fall directly under the transfer of training results (Zatsiorsky, 233). John mentioned the athletes that he has encountered that have a subtle mastery of any aspect of sport, regardless of the task put in front of them they can compete. To me that is the true definition of athleticism. “Specificity of adaptation increases with the level of sport master-ship,” (Zatsiorsky, 9). Athleticism then is the bleeding out of these skills into any area that the athlete applies them. Those whose specific adaptations transfer directly to their sport, but also to any other activity they are tasked with.
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Thinking upon this some more, I think JW, Ben, and David McK all point out instances of athleticism. We train our athletes to express this in an instance, be it known or novel. I looked at it is as far reaching. Being athletic in all domains, expressing athleticism across all tasks. The question then becomes does our training encompass that? Is that the X Factor,the ability to easily develop mastery in any athletic endeavor?
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I believe it is. For me athleticism is more about a person’s ability to complete an unknown task with the tools they possess. If their training is complete, progressive, and on a solid foundation of strength and movement pattern proficiency then the tools available to them should solve most tasks. We all know the guy/gal or is AWESOME at one sport/skill and can’t dribble a basketball. No one ever mistook that person as an athlete no matter how awesome they are at their given sport.
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Dennis makes a good point on athleticism having its instances. We spend countless hours training and practicing for split seconds for opportunity. I wouldn’t say without question the “it” factor can be developed in the gym but we certainly can build the skills and competence in the gym to give the athlete the opportunity.
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@menacedolan I interpreted looked at it the same way you did with it being a a far reaching definition. we give them the ability through mastering the primal movement patterns through different planes of motion the ability to effectively express their movement. now when they leave us and go to their SPP or sport that will determine how these interactions need to take place and further developed. the example john uses is pool vaulting. could you take someone who is athletic, and have them execute it? no is a specific skill, but I would argue some who has a high level of athleticism is going to pick that task op much quicker then say someone who can only run in a straight line.
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Continuing on with listening to the video for the second time, John describes the three circles that intersect to create the X-Factor. Of the 3, athleticism is the greatest component that we can have influence. We can affect the mental state to some extent, but athleticism is our wheel house. The sports coaches will have to fill in the other circles
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Athlete vs athleticism? I keep going back to Athleticism as a thing, something that some people posses innately more than others, and something that can be developed and grows. certain people display certain levels of athleticism or coordination from birth that others simply do not. One guy can walk and chew gum without falling over, the other can not. Athletes also possess varying degrees of athleticism, even within the same sport. Athletes can be extremely athletic and mediocre in their sport, and athletes can be incredibly good at their sport but not incredibly athletic, depending on the sport of course. I think the fact that you can have people in the same sport doing relatively similar things but coming out the other end with wildly differing abilities proves that athleticism is a thing that can be developed. Otherwise we wouldn’t get better and i think there would be more similarities among athletes and their abilities, considering we are all the same species. I also apply this same sort of “logic” to the SAID principle and its relevancy to athleticism. If we can have people participating in the exact same activities but their skill levels so wildly different this can only be a product of their training. the things they do outside of actual competition determines their ability during competition, and their performance is an indicator for the success or failure of that training…
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When thinking about training athleticism we tend to look at how our program improves it which is correct but not complete. To paraphrase J Welly’s definition of “seamless and effortless primal movement proficiency” it’s clear that training primal movement patterns will have a positive effect on athleticism. To continue to drive adaptation in a trained/elite athlete the SAID principle is necessary. The SAID principle in training, along with skill acquisition will allow an athlete to excel at a given sport BUT athleticism is more than just one sport. Athleticism to me is more the expression of athletic traits in novel or unknown tasks. So how do you train athleticism: opportunity.
To train athleticism our job as strength coaches is to give the athlete as many tools as possible to safely and efficiently complete a task with relation to movement. We train movement patterns, defaults (ie posture and position), explosiveness, etc. This increases an athletes options or “language of movement”. The limiting factor for an athlete should be his imagination (or if we want to be a little more depressing, his genetic potential) not physical limitations. Our influence on this is in the gym, the athlete must be exposed to as many movement “problems” as possible to build his/her athleticism. John referred to the young kid who would benefit from throwing because it would teach him to be explosive. We technically can “teach” explosiveness in the gym but his understanding of explosive movement is magnified exponentially when asked to put a shot. Opportunity trains athleticism – the tools available are trained via the SAID principle.
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When John gives his definition of what athleticism is, “The ability to seamlessly and effortlessly combine primal movement patterns through space to accomplish a known and novel task.” What came to mind was the perfecting of the kinesiological pattern of movements, “this pattern constitutes the basic framework of the movement system.” This pattern is the can be represented as the primal movement patterns that make up our basic human movement. They later go on to describe the path to perfecting movement. First coordination in time and space, as well as motor functions is inefficient. Then adaptation starts to take place and the athlete ability more effectively manage the motor task increases. After even more time the process can be accurately executed in s short period of time. This sounds like the journey of perfecting the primal movement patterns. One last part that stuck out to me was “interact in a specific pattern of simultaneous and sequential action”, or in John’s words seamlessly and effortlessly combine primal movement patterns Supertraining p.105-106
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